deskthority

SL89 - yes please, I look forward to the PM.

By way of update, today I received my new keyset and within moments of opening the vacuum sealed bag, there was disappointment. There are some clear flaws in my set, which is a great shame. I snapped some photos and sent them off to my supplier, explaining that I'd like to keep the keys and not simply obtain a refund. The answer came back... send them in for a refund. JOY. Why doesn't anyone seem to actually read, and absorb information sent in an email these days? The reply I got said words to the effect of, we want our customers to be happy but when we can't guarantee quality, there is little point in sending out another set.

On a general point, this particular profile is lovely and has a sound deadening quality - my BLUES sounds more THUDDY, I realise that isn't a proper word, but they do sound more TOPRE like that before. I am using the keys without any reduction bands and am shocked, they almost sound like BROWNS, but of course the click is still there. I am not surprised given the thickness of the keys. The other issue I have faced, and would be interested to hear if others have too is this, there is some slight rubbing on some keys, meaning they do not fully spring back up as they should. The left shift is particularly bad and I can see a little rough lighter spot, there the mould was broken I guess. The lettering on the caps is good, but my letter R is bad and has bleed, its rather noticeable. The RETURN key shows two parallel dimples, of the double shot. I don't know if this is a defect or simply a by-product of the manufacturing process. Finally, there does seem to be a difference in finish between keys and my photos try to show this, the larger keys are more matt and the smaller ones are more shiny. STRANGE, because I thought Signature Plastics were a highly rated firm with good reputation for quality. AND this is a FILCO endorsed product, and they take quality seriously, based on the build tolerances of their own KBs.

In any event, nearly £60 down and to be dealing with such issues is annoying.

I shall keep you posted of the outcome.

With best wishes,

The context of SP's reputation is: who else does small order doubleshots, period?

Our dealings with them (putting together many GBs and especially when commissioning new legends) has come back, again and again, to what a small outfit they are. Their QA is almost nonexistent. But their service is stellar, thanks to Melissa, who we all have to get in touch with far more frequently than customers really should.

In short: they're tiny. What they do for us is much appreciated (their rivals GMK are nothing like as flexible) but SP is nowhere near the consistent big boys. Always bear that in mind with them.

As for Filco: even imperfect doubleshots like these are a big improvement on their standard caps; which are junk. But it's still a strange fit to see a big mech brand taking SPs caps as their own. It's like the old days when mass market keyboards had better caps in general, and many were indeed made by SP's ancestor. But without the quality control.

Wow, SP really ought to pick up the ball on the quality concerns they seem to be having. I was really interested in buying myself a set of these after learning that the Filco-stabiliser inserts were easily removed, but after reading about your your experience with this set, I'm not particularly keen on them anymore.

Sorry to see you disappointed by the set!

Thanks to both for informative replies about this issues. What pains me is that the set is really bloody good, and I love the shape/ profile/ colour/ legend etc. BUT the quality control is missing. I have never been brave enough for a GB, and to a newbie like me, its all rather complex when it comes to ordering. My contract is with KEYBOARDCO so I can't really contact SP about this directly, but I have been in touch with Melissa already, and perhaps I will drop her a line too, so see if she has any input into the matter.

For those interested, I've recorded two short clips, one with thinner ABS caps, and one with double shots and thicker caps. The latter has the hum of my tumble drier, sorry about this, but from where I sit, I can hear a difference, and they certainly FEEL different. This is something I was not expecting.

Comments welcome. Recorded with the SAMSON GO Mic, so its reasonable quality.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/z54w5janyie9 ... 31wQa?dl=0

Even with what I've already said, I'm still a bit surprised at the problems SP is having with this particular set. Usually, they'll screw up a few keys, which will be consistently wrong for everyone. This time, the issues seem more widely distributed. Odd.

I've got caps from them in the same profile (SA) which I'm happy enough about to still routinely show off, even after a year of ownership.



The only issues with this set is the odd-profiled mods (Shifts and especially Backspace) which were a limitation of SP's molds at the time. Backspace is getting replaced with Round 5. Shift, someday!

I'll listen to your recording when I'm in from the noise. Meanwhile, here's what my set sounds like on MX reds:

J and F: They can't do them better! Order them centered and you will not have a problem with these.
The J-ret has been stolen from my grab boxes!


The 2.75 units right Shif t is does not fit!


The 2 units Back Space key doesn't fit either, is it properly pushed down?

7bit wrote:J and F: They can't do them better! Order them centered and you will not have a problem with these.
The J-ret has been stolen from my grab boxes!


The 2.75 units right Shif t is does not fit!


The 2 units Back Space key doesn't fit either, is it properly pushed down?

Sorry 7bit but I can never seem to understand your posts. Can someone kindly translate?

ShivaYash wrote: Sorry 7bit but I can never seem to understand your posts. Can someone kindly translate?

7bit wrote:J and F: They can't do them better! Order them centered and you will not have a problem with these. <-- "Filco seemingly doesn't know what SP can and cannot do, and SP won't tell them before it's too late.".

The J-ret has been stolen from my grab boxes! <-- "The ISO Return key is so warped it should have been sorted out by SP's quality assurance department in the first place (and put into the grab box that 7bit later got)".


The 2.75 units right Shif t is does not fit! <-- "While the right Shift key has no kerning problem in this case, it is a bit too wide and might even have a different surface structure compared to the other keys.".


The 2 units Back Space key doesn't fit either, is it properly pushed down? <-- "The Backspace key seems much higher than the key to the left of it. Might I humbly suggest that this could be a handling error and easily resolved?".

Better? (Sorry 7bit )

I am sorry for you...

ShivaYash wrote: Seems like just one incident.

But you are the SECOND incident after the German guy... Not bad...

Anyway, you are British and you are lucky, you can have back your money without too much problems...

If this stuff is not cr*p, I don't know what it is...

Halvar wrote:

ShivaYash wrote: Sorry 7bit but I can never seem to understand your posts. Can someone kindly translate?

7bit wrote:J and F: They can't do them better! Order them centered and you will not have a problem with these. <-- "Filco seemingly doesn't know what SP can and cannot do, and SP won't tell them before it's too late.".

The J-ret has been stolen from my grab boxes! <-- "The ISO Return key is so warped it should have been sorted out by SP's quality assurance department in the first place (and put into the grab box that 7bit later got)".


The 2.75 units right Shif t is does not fit! <-- "While the right Shift key has no kerning problem in this case, it is a bit too wide and might even have a different surface structure compared to the other keys.".


The 2 units Back Space key doesn't fit either, is it properly pushed down? <-- "The Backspace key seems much higher than the key to the left of it. Might I humbly suggest that this could be a handling error and easily resolved?".

Better? (Sorry 7bit )

Thanks! Much better.

I understood the original version... maybe I spend too much time on here.

Exactly my thoughts ...

ShivaYash, i wasnt able to get a hold of who i bought it off of, so i am kind of reluctant to put his info out there (even privately) but if i hear from him I'll surely send it.

Also, that sucks about your set, do keep us informed of any outcomes that either resolve them.

Thanks again chaps, I have the keys on my KB and they really do feel lovely, despite their obvious and annoying flaws. I'm returning to the supplier after Christmas, as I am now not in London. However perhaps I won't bother getting a replacement set as in a few days I pick up my brand spanking new 87u 55g!
(I'll be taking photos and selling another brand new 87u in time for Christmas, but delivery won't be until early Jan '15).

Topre keys aren't as available as Cherry MX, which is a shame, as the SA profile is really nice and suits me.

Does SP do a Topre keyset?

Merry Christmas to all.
SY

Muirium wrote: Even with what I've already said, I'm still a bit surprised at the problems SP is having with this particular set. Usually, they'll screw up a few keys, which will be consistently wrong for everyone. This time, the issues seem more widely distributed. Odd.

I've got caps from them in the same profile (SA) which I'm happy enough about to still routinely show off, even after a year of ownership.



The only issues with this set is the odd-profiled mods (Shifts and especially Backspace) which were a limitation of SP's molds at the time. Backspace is getting replaced with Round 5. Shift, someday!

I'll listen to your recording when I'm in from the noise. Meanwhile, here's what my set sounds like on MX reds:

These look fab M. What did you think of the recording, I'll admit, the difference is nuanced on the recording, but I feel the Cherry MX 'clack' is less.

If you want third-party caps on a Topre 87-key board... well, that's what the Cooler Master NovaTouch TKL is for.

ShivaYash wrote: Thanks again chaps, I have the keys on my KB and they really do feel lovely, despite their obvious and annoying flaws. I'm returning to the supplier after Christmas, as I am now not in London. However perhaps I won't bother getting a replacement set as in a few days I pick up my brand spanking new 87u 55g!
(I'll be taking photos and selling another brand new 87u in time for Christmas, but delivery won't be until early Jan '15).

Topre keys aren't as available as Cherry MX, which is a shame, as the SA profile is really nice and suits me.

Does SP do a Topre keyset?

Merry Christmas to all.
SY

Topre tmk does not have an SA set availible as retail. But the Realforce 104UG is an SA alike profile, and you can mount the Cherrry MX caps such as your Filco set on a CM Novatouch.

The black keyboard wearing those SA caps up there is indeed my NovaTouch! Wouldn't think I'd keep nice caps like that stuck on MX would you?

And the HiPro Realforce is a gem in its own right, with PBT sphericals which are arguably even nicer than my doubleshots.



The cream 104UK version is a Leopold commissioned exclusive in Korea. Like all pale Topres, it is so much better than black!



When Topre does a TKL HiPro, I'm going to have to start selling stuff to fund my acquisition. It'll be irresistible.

O my god! What a pretty kb... A TKL version and it shold be the perfect one!

See what I mean?

Yeo, my next board is a TKL hipro! Any idea when it may be due?

Nope. It's on the same list as the Bluetooth HHKB… so obvious, so required, and yet so unobtainable. C'mon Topre! We're ready!

For the truly well heeled, you can of course buy a HiPro and a TKL Realforce and move the caps. HiPro caps fit just nicely on a standard Realforce or even HHKB! Alas, the reverse is not true. The HiPro (mostly) needs its special Hi Profile caps, as its switch housings are (mostly) longer, too:

Topre prices are to buy two keyboards to compose one ... If I were a rich man ...

Muirium wrote: Nope. It's on the same list as the Bluetooth HHKB… so obvious, so required, and yet so unobtainable. C'mon Topre! We're ready!

For the truly well heeled, you can of course buy a HiPro and a TKL Realforce and move the caps. HiPro caps fit just nicely on a standard Realforce or even HHKB! Alas, the reverse is not true. The HiPro (mostly) needs its special Hi Profile caps, as its switch housings are (mostly) longer, too:

Muirium wrote: See what I mean?

Surely you have seen that other new Realforce Hi-Pro in black and white and grey right?

I did.


https://www.justmyshop.com/camp/realforcehipro

Hot damn: the Round 5 Realforce! Just Systems does some very tasty JIS layout boards, in fact I had my eye on a Realforce 91U of theirs during my recent Tenso acquisition. I will be back when they do the TKL version of this one!

Damn it. I keep looking at that page. Someone buy one of these and post pretty porn for all of us!!

Muirium wrote: Damn it. I keep looking at that page. Someone buy one of these and post pretty porn for all of us!!

How much do they cost lol, im sure i can switch to JIS for the greater good after all.

I see a couple of prices on the page. The higher one is 25,980 円 = $219. I can't tell what the difference is meant to be, maybe a sale? Anyway, if you want to bite the tasty, tasty bullet (and gain my sincere envy) you could talk to 002 about it. He has a pretty JUST Systems Realforce already and knows his way around exports!

Be sure to read of its amazing features:

"Ichitaro" only 30 anniversary of the now unobtainable, limited original design

In collaboration with the East pre Inc., somewhere nostalgic motif design and color is reminiscent of the keyboard of "PC dawn", I was coloring the body and the key top.

"ESC key" to be frequently used in familiar ESC menu in Ichitaro adopted the red "Ichitaro" brand color, I put the accent on the body.

Key top was produce a retro feeling to effectively place the cream and gray color.

http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... &sandbox=1

"PC Dawn" sounds like Japanese horror movie to me, but in a good way…

Thanks to OP for bearing with me while i hijacked his thread, and thanks to Muirium for the hook up.

Just to get back to topic, the FILCO (SP) caps have now been sent back for a refund. I did use them for a few days but am sad to report, that even in this short time frame, my right thumb managed to get a nice shine spot on the spacebar. Perhaps I have thick skin, but I would have expected such a thick key cap to be made of a tougher material, able to withstand shine. Perhaps I am wrong?