Keymacs keyboard review (Matias Clicky)

[Chyros]

Today we look at the Keymacs keyboard! A high-end machined metal brick aimed towards Emacs users. This thing is quite the piece of kit - also, it's a good time to revisit Matiases a little bit!

[Bjerrk]

Well, colour me excited!

Edit: Now watched - nice review! Bit of a coincidence that it ended with the words "Colour me impressed!"

[TNT]

Why does it sound so good?

[thefarside]

Nice review! Looks like an amazing recreation. I wonder if the creator has any plans beyond this version.

[Go-Kart]

I have been waiting for you to get your hands on one of these, Chyros! Glad to see it didn't disappoint.

I must say, I could never envision spending such money on a keyboard but if there was a board that would tip me over the edge, it'd be a Keymacs. What switches would I choose though...?

[Muirium]

The MX blue comparison had me hooting in laughter! Aye, not a fair fight, no contest at all.

Pity the brown Alps model is out of stock. That’s all that’s keeping me from nabbing it. (Ahem. And the fact it costs as much as my laptop.)

The programming looks a lot of shite, but. You really prefer that workflow over QMK on Xwhatsit Model F? I agree they’re nerdy and awkward, but Pandrew’s editor (and Hasu’s original TMK) work faultlessly, even on Safari. It’s the bit between web layout and getting the thing onto your keyboard where the experience nosedives. Which is, I guess, where VIA/VIAL comes in. I tried a bit of that but I’d already had enough! I had my Kishsaver and the beamspring the way I wanted it, it was time for cold beer and enjoying the things.

[Bjerrk]

Pity the brown Alps model is out of stock. That’s all that’s keeping me from nabbing it. (Ahem. And the fact it costs as much as my laptop.)
[...]
I tried a bit of that but I’d already had enough! I had my Kishsaver and the beamspring the way I wanted it, it was time for cold beer and enjoying the things.

Ah yes, the good old "I'd buy this premium product if only a slightly more premium model was in stock, but I'll have you know I own a very expensive laptop, a kishsaver and a beamspring keyboard" routine

[Muirium]

Don’t forget the part when I tell you how little I got those IBMs for. That’s the kicker.

I consider the M1 Air fairly priced. I paid a bit more for my last laptop: in 2013. Hoping this one lasts about as long.

[Bjerrk]

Don’t forget the part when I tell you how little I got those IBMs for. That’s the kicker.

Shh, don't spoil the second act!

[Muirium]

By the way, those thicc caps. How do they compare with Micro Switch SD series?



I'm intrigued by the new material and casting method. How do they feel vs. ABS and PBT? Are they smooth to the touch, like ABS or are they a bit more "textured" like PBT?

And, uh, any chance you could pop some alphas on a bigfoot Alps board like like an SGI Granite for profile comparison? No reason, honest…

[Chyros]

The MX blue comparison had me hooting in laughter! Aye, not a fair fight, no contest at all.

Pity the brown Alps model is out of stock. That’s all that’s keeping me from nabbing it. (Ahem. And the fact it costs as much as my laptop.)

The programming looks a lot of shite, but. You really prefer that workflow over QMK on Xwhatsit Model F? I agree they’re nerdy and awkward, but Pandrew’s editor (and Hasu’s original TMK) work faultlessly, even on Safari. It’s the bit between web layout and getting the thing onto your keyboard where the experience nosedives. Which is, I guess, where VIA/VIAL comes in. I tried a bit of that but I’d already had enough! I had my Kishsaver and the beamspring the way I wanted it, it was time for cold beer and enjoying the things.

Yeah, I really do. So keep in mind that the F77 had that VIA package as well, and even with a seasoned QMK user on Discord and screenshare I couldn't get the damn thing to work. I guess it just doesn't rhyme with me, but I can NEVER get that stuff to work well. Plus it's too complicated to remember if you don't use it for a bit. I'd have to start all over again already now, for example.

By the way, those thicc caps. How do they compare with Micro Switch SD series?



I'm intrigued by the new material and casting method. How do they feel vs. ABS and PBT? Are they smooth to the touch, like ABS or are they a bit more "textured" like PBT?

And, uh, any chance you could pop some alphas on a bigfoot Alps board like like an SGI Granite for profile comparison? No reason, honest…

No promises, but who knows, something might just be coming your way .

The walls are slightly thinner I think but the interior is definitely more solid. This is a major difference between casting and injecting; injecting can't do solid blocks very well (heating/drying differences give warping and things like that), whereas casting is self-accelerating so blocks are actually easier.

The texture feels like neither I'd say. It's not slick like ABS but it's not as coarsely textured as most PBT caps are either. The keys feel remarkably dry and the texture is very fine. It's almost like you're typing on the tiniest gauge of sandpaper.

[lispnick]

The texture feels like neither I'd say. It's not slick like ABS but it's not as coarsely textured as most PBT caps are either. The keys feel remarkably dry and the texture is very fine. It's almost like you're typing on the tiniest gauge of sandpaper.

That might have something to do with the fact that the aluminium bases I use for creating the moulds are indeed sand-blasted to get rid of the tool marks. This makes the castings look matte and slightly rough and the sand-blasted texture is preserved on the final keycap.

[Muirium]

Cool. Rough textured caps are quite my thing. Trouble is: they soon wear smooth if they're ABS. How durable do you reckon yours are?

I think the big difference in sound between ABS and PBT may be the speed of sound in both of them. PBT is much more treble for a given thickness than bassy ABS. I bet the speed of sound in PBT is quite a bit faster. A bit like throwing stones on a frozen lake: ice sounds extra sharp and echoes really ghostly, as sound travels through it more than 10X its speed in air.

And, uh, any chance you could pop some alphas on a bigfoot Alps board like like an SGI Granite for profile comparison? No reason, honest…

No promises, but who knows, something might just be coming your way .

[lispnick]

Cool. Rough textured caps are quite my thing. Trouble is: they soon wear smooth if they're ABS. How durable do you reckon yours are?

Only time will tell. I did not have access to any machines to simulate the wear, I use mine as a daily driver with the first batch of keycaps for nearly three years, they still look and feel ‘as new’. Big plus I think is that they do not get glossy over time.

[Muirium]

Three years of front line use is plenty enough testing. More convincing, really, than simulated wear on a jig. Impressive.

[Bjerrk]

I think the big difference in sound between ABS and PBT may be the speed of sound in both of them. PBT is much more treble for a given thickness than bassy ABS. I bet the speed of sound in PBT is quite a bit faster. A bit like throwing stones on a frozen lake: ice sounds extra sharp and echoes really ghostly, as sound travels through it more than 10X its speed in air.

Generally, speed of sound is closely related to hardness or rigidity. Indeed, in a perfectly rigid body, the speed of sound would formally be infinite (disturbances propagating instantly). (Speed of sound)^2 is linear in the elastic modulus (and depends inversely on the density of the material as well).

I googled the Young's moduli and the densities and computed the speed of sound to be approx 10% higher in ABS than PBT!

(But the data I found had pretty wide margins of error, so not a super solid result:
ABS:
Density: 1.0-1.05 g/cm^3
Young's Modulus: 2-2.6 GPa

PBT:
Density: 1.3-1.38 g/cm^3
Young's Modulus: 1.93-3 GPa)

(Edit: brain fart)

[Muirium]

Ah, fair enough. My intuition is foiled by data!

I do always find PBT to be instantly recognisable as a loose cap in hand. They feel less dense and sound more “crinkly” to the touch. They’ve a sound difference to them every bit as much as tactile feel on skin. Thicc ABS feels nice in hand, and a good bit closer to wood than lightweight PBT does! But I don’t like typing on it as much. Too slippery. And I worry about the yellowing, always.

[Chyros]

And, uh, any chance you could pop some alphas on a bigfoot Alps board like like an SGI Granite for profile comparison? No reason, honest…

Will this do?

[Muirium]

Thanks!

How tall are they against other Alps caps? The (Apple IIgs ?) caps you’ve got there aren’t ones I know first hand. Are these the same height as those?

[Chyros]

Thanks!

How tall are they against other Alps caps? The (Apple IIgs ?) caps you’ve got there aren’t ones I know first hand. Are these the same height as those?

They're the stock caps. I'm not sure which ones you're referring to specifically Oo .

[Muirium]

Staple diet Alps boards (and caps) like these:

wiki/Alps_Bigfoot

Apple’s caps were always goofy. I wouldn’t mix and match on my vintage Apple boards (AEK family and irrelevant here M0110). But my SGI is another matter.

[Chyros]

Staple diet Alps boards (and caps) like these:

wiki/Alps_Bigfoot

Apple’s caps were always goofy. I wouldn’t mix and match on my vintage Apple boards (AEK family and irrelevant here M0110). But my SGI is another matter.

Ah, you mean the IIc caps vs OEM profile ones? The IIc ones aren't very tall, but they're higher up than you'd think.

[hellothere]

Nice vid! I'm especially fond of your videos where you either have a really good keyboard or a really bad keyboard.

Now I want a video of Ellipse's new beamspring.

[Chyros]

Now I want a video of Ellipse's new beamspring.

One of those *should* be coming my way when it's finished . Can not wait to try that out!

[Bjerrk]

Nice vid! I'm especially fond of your videos where you either have a really good product or a really bad product.

I think that's an almost universal statement about fun reviews

[Muirium]

Meh is meh.

[oscillik]

Really glad to see that the texture holds up for 3+ years