deskthority

Hello all,

I just thought I would create a quick thread for some early photos of my lucky Tandem find at the end of February! I haven't cleaned it up yet, just took most of the caps off and snapped a few photos. I completely forgot this thing would come with a brown SKCL lock switch, so I initially though 'what the hell? The Caps Lock is stuck!' lol. Super excited about having one of those now too! Turns out mine is also SKCL brown, so I'm starting to think that those striped ambers were either a large customer's special order or perhaps some sort of limited/small batch run of amber switches made to Tandem's specifications early on in this terminal's life. I only suggest that, as I think either E3E or Matt mentioned their board didn't even have a serial number on it...though perhaps it could have come off as it seems to be a sticker.

Either way, I'm not disappointed in the slightest! Still quite thrilled at finally snagging a 'great' find on Ebay that's deserving of that title
Typing on this keyboard, even straight out of the shipping box without any cleaning, is a wonderful experience - so smooth. I quite like the weight of these linears. I will likely post a few more photos of it opened up and also after I clean it up a bit. It's strange how this keyboard's caps always seem to go a funky orange instead of the typical yellow that all the other ABS stuff does...

Nice man! That board indeed looks very clean for how old it is! I think it's really strange that f1 is such a bigger key than all the other function keys - I wonder what the reason for that design was. I kind of like that double shot blank cap, hahaha. It's cute.

What is your plan for the board? Switch harvest, convert, or keep it as piece of keyboard history/legendary ebay find? Also you should totally do a typing demo on youtube

You did good with this one, dude! Congrats again on the awesome find!

Thanks man! Yes, I should do a typing demo...just as soon as the caps and board are cleaned up and dry. Took a couple photos of the switch internals - I swear this is how clean the insides were before the photo! I'm even more surprised, given the gaping hole that SKCL switches all have in their top housings.

I really just want to keep it as is for now...even if that means I won't really be able to use it on my computer. I may need to put these switches into a future project because it would ultimately be a shame to have them site unused. If I do that, I think it would be best for me to transfer them into another vintage alps board - a worthy one like a Zenith board perhaps...then I would transfer its switches into the Tandem so that it can be a complete board again. Whatever I decide, scrapping the board and salvaging just the switches won't be on my list - it's a rare keyboard and has its charms. I especially like the spring loaded feet that you need to push sideways before popping them up into position.

Harshmallow wrote: Whatever I decide, scrapping the board and salvaging just the switches won't be on my list - it's a rare keyboard and has its charms.]

Awesome.

//gainsborough wrote: Nice man! That board indeed looks very clean for how old it is! ...

Also you should totally do a typing demo on youtube
...

Congrats!
Please make a typing video if you can, as all of these Tandem terminal boards were scrapped without any video log.

Which era do these boards belong to exactly?

Alps Japan/USA used green/yellow for linear and cream/grey for heavy linear and alternate action.
Gold Star Alps Korea used brown for linear and alternate action, and amber juts for heavy linear — the two colour schemes curiously don't correspond.

The important detail is the PCB code, which should end in K (12KC____K). E3E (?) definitely had a K on the end of the serial, but he never checked the PCB code inside.

Interestingly, before Daewoo bought Leading Edge, they made some of Leading Edge's keyboards: the PCB still has the 12KC code, but also Daewoo's name. Daewoo may have been a subcontractor to Gold Star Alps, just as it appears that Hi-Tek and Alps USA shared the same PCB subcontractor.

However, the Daewoo PCB has no "K" in the PCB code even though it's clearly Korean made:

https://klikkyklik.wordpress.com/2016/04/20/dc-2014/

Menuhin wrote:

//gainsborough wrote: Nice man! That board indeed looks very clean for how old it is! ...

Also you should totally do a typing demo on youtube
...

Congrats!
Please make a typing video if you can, as all of these Tandem terminal boards were scrapped without any video log.

Which era do these boards belong to exactly?

Just to add to what Daniel wrote (thanks for the info btw Daniel) - these would be part of the first generation of Alps SKCL switches in the mid to late eighties. This board is from 1987 I believe, and these Tandem 6526's, from all the boards that have come up, appear to be from 1986 to 1987.

Looks great

Mine didn't have a serial number, idk about E3E's though. The sticker is there for it but there isn't anything printed on it.

Also Wingpad got one of these from the same ebay batch and it had Striped Amber

I mounted mine in a Zenith and it was very worthy indeed

What is also interesting is that how amazingly prone to yellowing these boards are, wayy worse than Apple.

Mattr567 wrote: What is also interesting is that how amazingly prone to yellowing these boards are, wayy worse than Apple.

Yeah it's pretty bad...makes any other yellowed board I have look new by comparison haha. Ok perhaps the striped ambers were used more frequently than I thought! Did Wingpad buy more than one, because the seller responded to someone here about the second one purchased and said it had brown switches...though they could have just checked any random one when they did that I suppose.

Harshmallow wrote:

Mattr567 wrote: What is also interesting is that how amazingly prone to yellowing these boards are, wayy worse than Apple.

Yeah it's pretty bad...makes any other yellowed board I have look new by comparison haha. Ok perhaps the striped ambers were used more frequently than I thought! Did Wingpad buy more than one, because the seller responded to someone here about the second one purchased and said it had brown switches...though they could have just checked any random one when they did that I suppose.

He got one I believe, its all in the luck I guess.

We don't know enough about them to make assumptions about if they were a limited run or something, but I have a feeling that they were made at the request of Tandem, kinda like the whole Apple/SKCM Amber thing.

At the very least we know that they weren't a dedicated switch since they reused the Amber slider.

Mattr567 wrote:

Harshmallow wrote:

Mattr567 wrote: What is also interesting is that how amazingly prone to yellowing these boards are, wayy worse than Apple.

He got one I believe, its all in the luck I guess.

We don't know enough about them to make assumptions about if they were a limited run or something, but I have a feeling that they were made at the request of Tandem, kinda like the whole Apple/SKCM Amber thing.

At the very least we know that they weren't a dedicated switch since they reused the Amber slider.

True. Actually, my theory is that they did that because for some reason, Gold Star Alps was limited in the slider colours they had available to them. Instead of just using a different slider color to denote a lighter keypress option on their 6526 boards (perhaps just a customer choice? Seems normal to have a choice between light and heavier linears.). From the info and boards we have so far, they only seemed to have Amber and Brown...possibly some blue SKCM as well in the Leading Edge boards. Cindy also said the boards from that school she sent to the shredder weren't Tandem boards, but they had striped Amber switches in them. I think there are other boards out there that could have these switches...perhaps if we found more of the other boards that came with SKCL browns like the Packard Bell or that Visual terminal board.

Typing Test! Plus...me banging on the keyboard. I think this is the smoothest and best sounding spacebar out of any keyboard I have. There is absolutely no stabilizer rattle.

Harshmallow wrote: True. Actually, my theory is that they did that because for some reason, Gold Star Alps was limited in the slider colours they had available to them. Instead of just using a different slider color to denote a lighter keypress option on their 6526 boards (perhaps just a customer choice? Seems normal to have a choice between light and heavier linears.). From the info and boards we have so far, they only seemed to have Amber and Brown...possibly some blue SKCM as well in the Leading Edge boards. Cindy also said the boards from that school she sent to the shredder weren't Tandem boards, but they had striped Amber switches in them. I think there are other boards out there that could have these switches...perhaps if we found more of the other boards that came with SKCL browns like the Packard Bell or that Visual terminal board.

Maybe. Gold Star Alps does have their mysterious ways. It would be great if Alps themselves could answer for us but I don't think that will ever happen. If only one of us got a job there!

Striped Amber's that didn't come from a Tandem?

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: The important detail is the PCB code, which should end in K (12KC____K). E3E (?) definitely had a K on the end of the serial, but he never checked the PCB code inside.

My PCB has the serial number 12KC002AK but it does not have a part number (they printed "part number" but nothing follows it). It has a "kips" logo on it and prominently displays "Made in Korea." I can provide pictures as needed.

Harshmallow wrote: As I think either E3E or Matt mentioned their board didn't even have a serial number on it...though perhaps it could have come off as it seems to be a sticker.

I only bought one Tandem and got lucky (although I did inquire as to buying multiple however they had dried up by the time I asked). Also, my board had a serial number. I got lucky but I suspect there is a pattern here (based on a conversation with E3E) and, if more of these pop up again, I will test my theory. I am always willing to gamble on Tandems

Harshmallow wrote: Cindy also said the boards from that school she sent to the shredder weren't Tandem boards, but they had striped Amber switches in them. I think there are other boards out there that could have these switches...perhaps if we found more of the other boards that came with SKCL browns like the Packard Bell or that Visual terminal board.

This is quite interesting, though... hmmm... I have personally been curious about the Visual Terminal board, it seems like the best candidate for Striped Ambers given its close resemblance to the Tandem boards.

Wingpad wrote:

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: The important detail is the PCB code, which should end in K (12KC____K). E3E (?) definitely had a K on the end of the serial, but he never checked the PCB code inside.

My PCB has the serial number 12KC002AK but it does not have a part number (they printed "part number" but nothing follows it). It has a "kips" logo on it and prominently displays "Made in Korea." I can provide pictures as needed.

Harshmallow wrote: As I think either E3E or Matt mentioned their board didn't even have a serial number on it...though perhaps it could have come off as it seems to be a sticker.

I only bought one Tandem and got lucky (although I did inquire as to buying multiple however they had dried up by the time I asked). Also, my board had a serial number. I got lucky but I suspect there is a pattern here (based on a conversation with E3E), if more of these pop up again, I will test my theory. I am always willing to gamble on Tandems

Harshmallow wrote: Cindy also said the boards from that school she sent to the shredder weren't Tandem boards, but they had striped Amber switches in them. I think there are other boards out there that could have these switches...perhaps if we found more of the other boards that came with SKCL browns like the Packard Bell or that Visual terminal board.

This is quite interesting, though... hmmm... I have personally been curious about the Visual Terminal board, it seems like the best candidate for Striped Ambers given its close resemblance to the Tandem boards.

Thanks for clarifying! I'm curious about your theory - it does look like the one you got has the earliest serial number of the 5. The next lowest was the third one at 17007 and that one had a broken F key, revealing a brown SKCL.

Harshmallow wrote: Thanks for clarifying! I'm curious about your theory - it does look like the one you got has the earliest serial number of the 5. The next lowest was the third one at 17007 and that one had a broken F key, revealing a brown SKCL.

I will disclose it in due time; however, for now, I do not want to send anyone on a wild goose chase. Although I will place a (grim) bet about the other boards sold as part of this find ... based on what I can see, none of them will have Striped Ambers.

Wingpad wrote: My PCB has the serial number 12KC002AK but it does not have a part number (they printed "part number" but nothing follows it). It has a "kips" logo on it and prominently displays "Made in Korea." I can provide pictures as needed.

12KC002AK is the model or part number for the PCB itself. The completed assembly model/part will have a code that starts K or KF. See [wiki]Alps keyboard codes[/wiki]. That's a very early code (002) — either this is only the second keyboard ever designed with SKCL switches, or the second design made in Korea. Having clear dating evidence for this keyboard would be useful.

What I'm trying to establish is whether a final "K" indicates Gold Star Alps in Korea, and whether SKCL Brown/Striped Amber, SKCL Amber and brown SKCL Lock are all specific to Gold Star Alps keyboards. Gold Star Alps clicky switches are still blue, just the same as those made in Japan, but the linear switches appear to have been given different colours.

Photos of PCBs with the -K code are useful, as are photos of PCBs marked "Korea" (or where the label on the back of the case mentions "Gold Star Alps" or "Korea" or a Gold Star Alps FCC ID). The more photos the better.

Harshmallow wrote: Typing Test! Plus...me banging on the keyboard. I think this is the smoothest and best sounding spacebar out of any keyboard I have. There is absolutely no stabilizer rattle.

Yesssssss! I was waiting for this. Sounds amazing, dude. I just got my 5140 in the mail yesterday, so I'll have to compare the sound of SKCL brown to SKCM brown - expect a video tomorrow!

So of the 5 from this recent find, we've confirmed that 1 has Striped Amber, 1 has Brown, 1 (mine) is yet to arrive, so what about the other 2?

subcat wrote: So of the 5 from this recent find, we've confirmed that 1 has Striped Amber, 1 has Brown, 1 (mine) is yet to arrive, so what about the other 2?

The third one sold also has brown, as a keycap is broken off and you can see the switch.

Crap - I thought I had posted these a few days ago. Here's my PCB/Keyboard internals. It's the same situation as Wingpad's with the model number, made in Korea and the part number field with nothing beside it. Also has a KIPS logo on the bottom.

Another one of those PCBs with the corners missing — never seen that in a "real" Alps keyboard before. It's also the second time that a Korean-made keyboard has used an Alps PCB code on a clearly non-Alps PCB. Even the PCBs that I think Alps USA sourced externally, were only ever Alps branded (same for Hi-Tek, who I think used the same PCB manufacturer).

Not sure on the date, either. D8748 isn't 1987: it's the model of microcontroller. The Mitsubishi chip seems to be 1987 (72540) and I can't read TI date codes. The label seems to be 1989 though.

K for Korea now does seem reasonably certain.

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: Another one of those PCBs with the corners missing — never seen that in a "real" Alps keyboard before. It's also the second time that a Korean-made keyboard has used an Alps PCB code on a clearly non-Alps PCB. Even the PCBs that I think Alps USA sourced externally, were only ever Alps branded (same for Hi-Tek, who I think used the same PCB manufacturer).

Not sure on the date, either. D8748 isn't 1987: it's the model of microcontroller. The Mitsubishi chip seems to be 1987 (72540) and I can't read TI date codes. The label seems to be 1989 though.

K for Korea now does seem reasonably certain.

Honestly though - the person they hired to sign all the date codes on the KIPS labels did a terrible job. Those could even be 7's - which would make more sense to me as some of the others in this find are labeled 86.

And what does the 'kips' represent? Is it the Korea Information Processing Society? Or is that more like a standard they need to stamp on certain products in Korea? Just a quick search for kips pcb is why I ask: http://journals.kips.or.kr/digital-library/kips/4636

No idea, but if you get a straight-down photo of it I'll convert it into an SVG for the record, and see if Google Images recognises it. At least we have recognisable letters — with the [wiki]Monogram SMK derivative series[/wiki] I can't even determine the order of the letters or precisely what letters are present.

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: No idea, but if you get a straight-down photo of it I'll convert it into an SVG for the record, and see if Google Images recognises it. At least we have recognisable letters — with the [wiki]Monogram SMK derivative series[/wiki] I can't even determine the order of the letters or precisely what letters are present.

Will do - would you like a photo of the kips logo on the PCB, or of that circular date stamp with the logo on it?

The PCB version looks more accurate — the label appears to have rather weedy printing.

I won't make a new post - but I just got mine. SKCL Brown.

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: The PCB version looks more accurate — the label appears to have rather weedy printing.

Sorry for the delay Mr. Beardsmore! Here are some photos of the logo. I took one with and another without flash. I hope at least one will suffice for your purposes. And congrats Subcat, I hope the browns you got were also nice and clean - they're wonderful switches.

So I finally got around to making a quick vid. of SKCM brown alps on my IBM 5140 to compare with your SKCL brown alps.
I think the acoustics of case vs. no case make it really hard to definitively say what the difference between the sounds are - but to me they sound more clacky than thocky, if that makes sense. The have a kind of *sshhhiiick* sound when you press the keys, and they spring back incredibly fast. They may actually be my favorite alps switch so far (still haven't tried them all yet). It's very satisfying.

I don't mean to hijack your thread, Harsh - I just thought this would be the most relevant place to put the vid!