deskthority

Just remember that if we are going to request crazy layouts, it's going to require some crazy custom keyset to go along with it.

But split spacebar sounds amazing.

yes, that's the problem with alps and as far as I know only SP can help us with that.

I'd, as always, like to avoid SP if possible... Their Alps stuff is just so expensive relative to the quality, and honestly the quality of DCS isn't a huge amount better than Tai-Hao who can give us the original stabiliser mounts on longer keys.

I have to check with Melissa (SP) on pricing and options, but the project becomes incredibly complicated if we go custom keycap sizes.

Can't we get e.g. Gateron to start making ALPS PBT sets? Or wherever you had the Topre PBT spacebars made, matt3o?
{They may have a crazy MOQ, but if we talk MD to run this, I'd guess it may sell even 500 sets - MD regularly runs ABS ALPS sets, like every 2 months, and they seem to be reasonably successful.}

That would be amazing. I really enjoy my Gateron PBT blanks. Putting those on Alps switches...

flabbergast wrote: Can't we get e.g. Gateron to start making ALPS PBT sets?

They asked Shadovved $5000 to make a mold for the ISO Enter key, so I don't want to know what an entire keyset with a different stem would cost.

Maybe Matt3o's secret keycap source for the Whitefox would be more accommodating, but that's just a supposition.

scottc wrote: I'd, as always, like to avoid SP if possible... Their Alps stuff is just so expensive relative to the quality, and honestly the quality of DCS isn't a huge amount better than Tai-Hao who can give us the original stabiliser mounts on longer keys.

I actually second this thought. The SP Alps caps have a very tight fit, I broke a couple stems this week. In addition, the stabilizer situation is plain annoying. To my knowledge, the only way to make an SP Alps cap with Cherry mount stabilizer inserts fit onto a plate with Alps stabilizers cutouts is with a custom stablizer wire.

I like the SP DCS profile more than Tai-Hao's profile, but I prefer the make and quality of Tai Hao and their easy compatibility with Alps stablizers.

Matt3o, since you mentioned you want this project to be more different, in order to be interesting to you, how about the following idea (this works well with the split spacebar): create a slight angle between the left and the right hand corresponding keys, to make the keyboard layout more "ergonomic", but without actually cutting the PCB or keyboard in half. Just a slight angle, that perhaps creates a place for a modifier key between the two split space bars. Just to have the hands better positioned while typing, but without creating any build complexities or user layout adjustments problems.

Laser wrote: Matt3o, since you mentioned you want this project to be more different, in order to be interesting to you, how about the following idea (this works well with the split spacebar): create a slight angle between the left and the right hand corresponding keys, to make the keyboard layout more "ergonomic", but without actually cutting the PCB or keyboard in half. Just a slight angle, that perhaps creates a place for a modifier key between the two split space bars. Just to have the hands better positioned while typing, but without creating any build complexities or user layout adjustments problems.

@Laser do you mean something sort of like this, but with 60 keys and with modifiers of slightly more traditional shape and size so you're not so dependent upon layers for common keys?

I mean something like that *only* in angle, but starting and keeping the exact same layout as of a normal 60% keyboard (or whatever the decided layout will be; it would just need the split spacebar, which was already proposed).

I only proposed such a thing because it wouldn't make things complicated, but could prove helpful with typing and add a different twist. Also the small inverted V space formed between the two "halves" could be used to place a new modifier, or (in the middle) a small pointing device, a trackpoint or a even a small, low-profile joystick.

That is an interesting and novel idea as 60% and ergonomic don't often go together. It could be cool.

There is an effort to add more keys to the Atreus. I find the Atreus a little lacking in the amount of the keys. Otherwise, I would buy it.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=70205.0

mmh interesting concept. a sort of Microsoft natural keyboard 4000 but 60%.

We are going to have the stabilizer issue anyway if we go custom keys.

matt3o wrote: mmh interesting concept. a sort of Microsoft natural keyboard 4000 but 60%.

Yes - perhaps without any "arching"/curving; simple, almost 180 angled, V shape? Well, it's just an idea.

This angle, just 60% (or whatever) format and very close "halves":



(image stolen from another running Alps thread)

discussion continues here workshop-f7/prototyping-the-next-thing-t13016.html