deskthority

For the converter, are you getting the hasu one?

Not sure, whatever works I guess.

Are SKCM Orange parallel with SKCM Blue? I have some click leafs that I can put in SKCM Orange, and I really want to try out Blue Alps. But they're just too expensive.

keycap wrote: Not sure, whatever works I guess.

Are SKCM Orange parallel with SKCM Blue? I have some click leafs that I can put in SKCM Orange, and I really want to try out Blue Alps. But they're just too expensive.

They're partly contemporary, if that's what you mean. Their construction is also fairly comparable as they're both first-gen Alps. The click leaf on other Alps switches has been reported to be slightly different from those in blue Alps though.

Hi guys, what's the bottom out force of a linear-modded SKCM White?

ImbaHue wrote: Hi guys, what's the bottom out force of a linear-modded SKCM White?

Very light, I'd say around 60g bottom out force.

ImbaHue wrote: Hi guys, what's the bottom out force of a linear-modded SKCM White?

That same as that of an unmodded one, because the click leaf imparts orthogonal forces during bottoming-out. It's been measured at slightly below 60 gf.

Chyros wrote:

ImbaHue wrote: Hi guys, what's the bottom out force of a linear-modded SKCM White?

That same as that of an unmodded one, because the click leaf imparts orthogonal forces during bottoming-out. It's been measured at slightly below 60 gf.

Huh, I thought that the click leaf adds some friction to the slider which makes the switch feel a bit stiffer.

keycap wrote: Very light, I'd say around 60g bottom out force.

Chyros wrote: That same as that of an unmodded one, because the click leaf imparts orthogonal forces during bottoming-out. It's been measured at slightly below 60 gf.

So I linear-modded one of my Alps keyboard (SKCM White).

It doesn't feel like 60gf to me as my MX Reds felt heavier compared modded Alps White.

Thanks for the inputs. Been a fan of linears but I never thought a switch could be this smooth. Now I'm a believer.

Deeper into the Alps vortex I go!

ImbaHue wrote:

keycap wrote: Very light, I'd say around 60g bottom out force.

Chyros wrote: That same as that of an unmodded one, because the click leaf imparts orthogonal forces during bottoming-out. It's been measured at slightly below 60 gf.

So I linear-modded one of my Alps keyboard (SKCM White).

It doesn't feel like 60gf to me as my MX Reds felt heavier compared modded Alps White.

Thanks for the inputs. Been a fan of linears but I never thought a switch could be this smooth. Now I'm a believer.

Deeper into the Alps vortex I go!

Linear-modded White Alps were the switches that got me hooked on the SKCL/SKCM series.

And yeah, they really do feel lighter than MX Reds, but that may also be due to how smooth Alps are.

keycap wrote:

Chyros wrote:

ImbaHue wrote: Hi guys, what's the bottom out force of a linear-modded SKCM White?

That same as that of an unmodded one, because the click leaf imparts orthogonal forces during bottoming-out. It's been measured at slightly below 60 gf.

Huh, I thought that the click leaf adds some friction to the slider which makes the switch feel a bit stiffer.

If they're in good condition they shouldn't, that's why they added lubricant to the slider .

Chyros wrote:
that's why they added lubricant to the slider

And I keep dreaming that someone will discover the viable modern equivalent lubricant.

Silly idea but, couldn't we have some chemist or whoever scrape a bit of lubricant off of a slider and run a sample through some spectrometer to get a general idea of what it is? Then a modern approximation of the lubricant could be procured or perhaps produced if it does not exist.

I've seen them do the same thing on CSI a bunch of times so of course it will work!

emdude wrote: couldn't we have some chemist or whoever scrape a bit of lubricant off of a slider and run a sample through some spectrometer to get a general idea of what it is?

Go for it. Get back to us once your chemist friend gives you an answer.

Just trying to throw ideas out there, I know things aren't that simple and I sadly don't have such a friend anyway.

I have a collection of about 130 Green Alps I desoldered from a pretty grimy looking keyboard a while back, and the switches just kinda suck. I have tried going through thorough cleaning, taking them all apart cleaning with detergent, and some with alcohol. I have never tried NIB Alps of any kind, however the Blue Alps in my 60% are in very good condition and feel great. When removing the click leaf from a blue and swapping in the spring from the green switch, I get a very smooth and desirable switch. Using either the slider or the top case from the Green switch results in a scratchy, noisy, and unpleasant switch. Reading through this (fantastic) thread, I see this:

jacobolus wrote: Unfortunately, in some cases the sliders and/or top housings have abraded plastic, and can’t be fixed even with careful cleaning and added lubricant.

Which seems to be the case with mine, as even applying a little krytox mix to the green slider and top case only made a marginal difference. So I guess my question is, is there any other possible way to salvage these into something usable, or are they pretty much junk? I was hoping to use them in a second 60% but I have no interest in them as is. Luckily I didn't pay much for the board ($30) but I would really hate to see them all go to waste.

emdude wrote: Silly idea but, couldn't we have some chemist or whoever scrape a bit of lubricant off of a slider and run a sample through some spectrometer to get a general idea of what it is? Then a modern approximation of the lubricant could be procured or perhaps produced if it does not exist.

I've seen them do the same thing on CSI a bunch of times so of course it will work!

Obviously I'd have done that already, but we don't have the kind if spectrometers I'd want to use .

pyrelink wrote: I have a collection of about 130 Green Alps I desoldered from a pretty grimy looking keyboard a while back, and the switches just kinda suck. I have tried going through thorough cleaning, taking them all apart cleaning with detergent, and some with alcohol. I have never tried NIB Alps of any kind, however the Blue Alps in my 60% are in very good condition and feel great. When removing the click leaf from a blue and swapping in the spring from the green switch, I get a very smooth and desirable switch. Using either the slider or the top case from the Green switch results in a scratchy, noisy, and unpleasant switch. Reading through this (fantastic) thread, I see this:

jacobolus wrote: Unfortunately, in some cases the sliders and/or top housings have abraded plastic, and can’t be fixed even with careful cleaning and added lubricant.

Which seems to be the case with mine, as even applying a little krytox mix to the green slider and top case only made a marginal difference. So I guess my question is, is there any other possible way to salvage these into something usable, or are they pretty much junk? I was hoping to use them in a second 60% but I have no interest in them as is. Luckily I didn't pay much for the board ($30) but I would really hate to see them all go to waste.

It's sad to say, but really, Alps can't be fixed once they're in that condition. I've tried so many times to get some of my White Alps switches in better condition, but no matter what I do, it seems like they always feel awful. But then all of my other White Alps switches feel great, as well as my Black Alps and Orange Alps. I've noticed that sometimes the slider gets scratched by either the click leaf or the contact leaf; this might be your problem. It's certainly evident in some of my White Alps switches.

pyrelink wrote: I have tried going through thorough cleaning, taking them all apart cleaning with detergent, and some with alcohol. [...] Using either the slider or the top case from the Green switch results in a scratchy, noisy, and unpleasant switch. [...] even applying a little krytox mix to the green slider and top case only made a marginal difference.

Well first, make sure that you actually successfully cleaned out all the dust/grit in the top housing. Just a soak in alcohol/detergent/whatever doesn’t cut it. You need to get into all the little inside edges with a cotton swab or something (or ideally use an ultrasonic cleaner). But if there are physical scratches in the plastic of the top housing, I don’t know any good way to buff them out.

I'm wondering weather really fine grit sand paper like 12000 grit, which is usually used for smoothing out fountain pens nibs would work for scratched stems / housing?

It's basically like a rubberized cloth, very flexible.

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Micro-Mesh-Abra ... DY_WyA49zw

For those who had missed it; more Alps-ness!

Do alps buckling spring keyboards only exist in ISO Chyros?

Wow, Chyros, how’d you dig that up? Even HaaTa doesn’t have one of those.

jacobolus wrote: Wow, Chyros, how’d you dig that up? Even HaaTa doesn’t have one of those.

Wow, I have something HaaTa doesn't?! Weeeeeeee!

(actually, in two weeks, you'll see something else he doesn't have .

Redmaus wrote: Do alps buckling spring keyboards only exist in ISO Chyros?

Nope, you can get them in ANSI too .

Space invaders, alps style! Only thing missing here is some 10-15 Oranges

I got these today (well on friday, but was away on a trip). Seem really nice, and I can't wait to put them in a board. Note the pack of small black tabs just left of bottom center. These are side tabs from the switch housing. These seem to be fragile and I think that when packing the switches, they should be wrapped in some soft cotton balls or something. Hopefully, this will not affect the switch installation or stability.

BTW, I don't know if it has been mentioned in the thread, but is there any difference between springs in blues, oranges and greens? Or are they the same? They are the same generation, so I assume they are identical or quite similar. And the main difference in Amber ones, compared to the aforementioned ones, is the spring weight, right?

alh84001 wrote:
These are side tabs from the switch housing. These seem to be fragile and I think that when packing the switches, they should be wrapped in some soft cotton balls or something.

Those triangular tabs break off all the time. They are probably irrelevant once the switch body is soldered in place.

Cotton balls would be worse because the fibers would tangle in and get pulled out. Crisp tissue paper would be better if you really wanted to wrap them.

alh84001 wrote: These are side tabs from the switch housing. These seem to be fragile and I think that when packing the switches, they should be wrapped in some soft cotton balls or something.

Those mainly break because people are careless when desoldering and removing switches (with some practice, if you disassemble keyboards carefully, it’s possible to get down to a rate of about 1 broken plastic tab per 100 switches). They are unlikely to break in transit, though you can wrap a bag of switches in 2-3 layers of bubble wrap if you want to be safe. Skip the cotton balls.

is there any difference between springs in blues, oranges and greens?

All three have different springs.

And the main difference in Amber ones, compared to the aforementioned ones, is the spring weight, right?

Amber switches have stiffer springs than any of the others you listed, as well as a much stiffer click leaf.

The plastic tabs/wings are fragile for sure, but are you certain it couldn't also be the age of the plastic?

I was desoldering SKCM Orange switches earlier, and for no reason at all, a piece of plastic on the bottom of a switch housing broke off, leaving a hole that you could look through from the top of the slider.

jacobolus wrote:

is there any difference between springs in blues, oranges and greens?

All three have different springs.

Can you please go into more details on this? Link to an existing resource is fine as well.

Hopefully at some point I can make some direct measurements of various Alps springs on HaaTa’s force gauge. No promises though.

Thanks. Nice pic with great detail. To my untrained eye orange and blue springs seem visually the same (with green being less stiff).