Design database, drawings, vectorimages, CAD-files etc

[damorgue]

I thought we should make a place to store everything, for reference and to enable everyone to contribute. I have made 3D-scans of objects in the past and am making quite a lot of models atm. I have also checked some prices on several of my sub suppliers for parts whenever anyone posts drawings and such. This is very useful since I could for instance get my own Phantom plates made, case for keyboards etc. I think that the KMC case could be made cheaper as well. Now, it only works if everyone contributes and tries to get this rolling. It would not be beneficial for some in the short run, since I have seen quite a lot of overcharging for getting things milled or cut and then sold here, but in the long run, it would better serve the community.

What say you?

It could also be grouped so that everyone who is offering a certain design could be linked from it, so that everyone can compete on a fair level.

We could even include key cap designs, ones that have already been made (to keep track of and browse through, perhaps to find one that you can then try to get in the marketplace for instance, or check if it has already been made before starting a new GB), and ones that have not been made, to keep for future reference and potential group buys.

[Charlie_Brown_MX]

That’s a good idea. I don’t think a thread is the best place to keep that sort of information, but a section/subcategory in the wiki would be close to ideal.

[damorgue]

That’s a good idea. I don’t think a thread is the best place to keep that sort of information, but a section/subcategory in the wiki would be close to ideal.

Exactly what I had in mind. Caps, different cases, ErgoDOX, Phantom plates, Phantom PCB, any other creations, MX switches I just saw posted etc.

Spoiler:

[webwit]

Wiki sounds like a good place!

[damorgue]

Wiki sounds like a good place!

I have no idea how to start one/ organize it though, do you have a wiki for the wiki?

[webwit]

Yes!
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Contents

[damorgue]

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Design_database
At least there is something there for now.

[damorgue]

I wonder if 3D scans will cause troubles with copyrights etc. Below is an example of a failed scan, I need a better camera.

Spoiler:

[nfc]

What program do you use to assemble the shots?
I'm just thinking I have a friend addicted with photography with a wonderfull camera, a whiteroom, a load of lights and other nice equipment... I could ask him to take shots.

[dirge]

The wiki sounds like the perfect place for this.

[Charlie_Brown_MX]

I wonder if 3D scans will cause troubles with copyrights etc.

I can’t see how it would, as long as you don’t claim copyright over the design itself. You can claim copyright on the *drawing* you made of the design, but not the design itself. Being as the project would be non-commercial in nature that should make it even less likely to raise the ire of lawyers.

[damorgue]

[sarcasm] It seems I really got the ball rolling with this [/sarcasm]

[IvanIvanovich]

A nice idea for sure, unfortuneatly I have nothing to contribute as I am not good at these things. I actually quite like the failed scan... model M through eyes of the impressionist. Could be a poster candidate really. Can you fail scan me a Cherry board for a poster? lol.

[squarebox]

The sad truth is if these files are publicly available, someone will probably steal it and mass produce them.

[damorgue]

The sad truth is if these files are publicly available, someone will probably steal it and mass produce them.

I am probably ok with that. That would mean that they got made and released. It would not hurt us in any way and we could still, if we wanted, get them manufactured as well and it wouldn't cost us any more than if someone else hadn't copied it.

[Kalmarauder]

The sad truth is if these files are publicly available, someone will probably steal it and mass produce them.

It's only bad if you're a manufacturer because it means competition. If you're a consumer it means more availability and possibly lower prices.

[damorgue]

My point exactly. I consider myself to be the consumer in this case, even though I made the cad files, since I don't intend on any financial gain from it. The more producers that want to make them the merrier.

[MMTE]

Hello

I can't see that taking a 3D scan of something would be legally any different to taking a photo. And modeling something shouldn't legally be any different from drawing it.

But in my opinion there's not much point having a user generated database of rough CAD models. 3D scans would be better. I reckon the way to do this would be to scan keyboards at meet-ups - like keyboard parties You guys have those right?

The Kinect is a good way to scan and preserve textures. Failing that an old copy of DAVID-Laserscan (as the old versions - circa 2008 - were free).

In fairness, a photo database would be a start. If that's a no-goer then kiss 3D goodbye.

[damorgue]

I have stopped giving away my files for the caps since there are more and more people asking for them. I want a lawyer to state that it is ok first

I can't see that taking a 3D scan of something would be legally any different to taking a photo. And modeling something shouldn't legally be any different from drawing it.

True, but if we start producing things, then it is pretty close to plagiarism, copyright infringement, patent usage and undermining a company label's value. I am no expert in law-related stuff, and I agree that if we just save them there will be no problems. It is when we use them the problems arise. Publishing them in public will mean that we have made it possible for others to commit such infringements, and we could be held responsible. Again, I truly have no idea how the evaluate things like this.

But in my opinion there's not much point having a user generated database of rough CAD models. 3D scans would be better.

Who said anything about rough?
You will need a very high end scanner for the scans to be more exact than manual measurements and recreating it in CAD, especially these inorganic shapes.

[damorgue]

Anyway, I still think this needs some more pull behind it to make it happen. No one wants to share their stuff..

Does anyone have a laser cutter? I think it might be cheap it the sides are split. It can be stacked much better on a sheet with less waste as seen in first pic.

Spoiler:

[Gilgam]

it's a nice design. Does it fit the phantom pcb ?

[Xorpher]

Have you considered using an online service such as Ponoko to make cases like that?

I've been thinking about making a custom case using Ponoko, but I hadn't been able to find adequate plans.

Here's the site: http://www.ponoko.com/

They have quite a variety of materials, but Acrylic is the only real option for keyboards. Though a wooden case would be pretty cool, too.

[damorgue]

it's a nice design. Does it fit the phantom pcb ?

It can be made to fit almost anything with some small changes. In the first picture, I left some space to cut spacers in the alpha section. Those spacers could be used for screw points in the middle of the PCB. mounting holes along the edges of the pcb can be taken care of by the edge pieces.

I wanted it to be cheap which is why I wanted someone with access to a laser cutter. I had access to one, but I overused it and apparently it turns out I was never actually supposed to have access to it

[Xorpher]

Ah, okay. Would you make the plans publicly available if wiki was created?

[damorgue]

Sure, but I will need to finish it first and try it to ensure that it works. Probably going to make the first prototype fit the phantom. The hole for the cable hasn't been decided yet either.

Edit: Added some sort of feed through for now.


Anyways, as you can see, I only added some mounting holes in the corners. To make it fit a certain design, one would the size of the pcb (and plate if there is one) as well as the position and size of the mounting holes. This is why I wanted a database. Adding the holes once the dimensions are readily available is easy.

[Xorpher]

Where did you get your measurements from? Did you take them yourself?

[damorgue]

I have designed a couple of cases, but usually never decided what should fit within and thus have just estimated the dimensions and never finished one. This is why I would like a database with dimensions of popular keyboards.

For the keycaps, yes, I measured them and they are fairly accurate.