IBM 3277 - 78 Key APL

kuato · 25 Apr 2017, 23:03

New one on the bench!

I'll post more pictures over the next few days as I clean it up.

orihalcon · 26 Apr 2017, 02:06

Very nice! Haven't seen one of these before. Where did you find this one?

codemonkeymike · 26 Apr 2017, 02:12

Woweeewow, ill take 10. That's amazing APL keyboard.

kuato · 26 Apr 2017, 02:13

Same here, first time seeing one of these with the dark APL keys. The guys that found it were clearing a manufacturing company inventory that just happened to be on an old IBM site. They found it in one of the hidden rooms!

gnmar2723 · 26 Apr 2017, 03:37

Sheeet, are those triple-shots?

pr0ximity · 26 Apr 2017, 04:16

Loathe *entirely*

codemonkeymike · 26 Apr 2017, 04:23

gnmar2723 wrote: Sheeet, are those triple-shots?

Indeed they are, IBM didn't bother themselves with lowly double shots with dyesub

Slom · 26 Apr 2017, 07:23

Awesome find. Seems like Beamspring season started in the USA.

If you are not IBM management approved, please send it to me to avoid doing something illegal

andrewjoy · 26 Apr 2017, 09:41

All this beamspring . I need to get mine out and actually use it.

kuato · 26 Apr 2017, 14:09

Slom wrote: Awesome find. Seems like Beamspring season started in the USA.

If you are not IBM management approved, please send it to me to avoid doing something illegal

I thought that sticker was hilarious. I'm trying to get more info on the site where this was found.

andrewjoy wrote: All this beamspring . I need to get mine out and actually use it.

Beam springs seem to come in waves. Maybe recyclers now know that they can make money on these and don't trash them.

zslane · 26 Apr 2017, 19:11

Such sweet beamspring goodness!

IBM was doing the "Dolch" colorway two decades before Dolch. It should really be called the "3277" colorway. Why does Dolch get all the glory?

kuato · 27 Apr 2017, 06:54

The case and caps cleaned out nicely. The finish on the metal case is extremely durable. Here are some pcb shots:

Is there any hope of adapting this board with a replacement controller?

emdude · 27 Apr 2017, 07:01

kuato wrote: Is there any hope of adapting this board with a replacement controller?

I've asked about this too, since I have a 3277 as well. I don't think there is any easy way to do it, since the controller is integrated into the pad card.

Designing a brand-new xwhatsit/CommonSense-compatible PCB would probably be the most straightforward solution.

kuato · 27 Apr 2017, 07:10

emdude wrote: I've asked about this too, since I have a 3277 as well. I don't think there is any easy way to do it, since the controller is integrated into the pad card.

Designing a brand-new xwhatsit/CommonSense-compatible PCB would probably be the most straightforward solution.

Is there anyone that owns a 3277 and knows how to design a PCB? I'd imagine we would have to round up every 3277 owner to pony up for that project!

andrewjoy · 27 Apr 2017, 11:45

Love that oldschool solder mask, looks way nicer than modern stuff , and you can even see the traces .
As long as the capacitive matrix is the same( it should be ) There is no reason you cannot use this PCB.

It looks as if many of the connection to the cols are here

: Untitled.png (417.5 KiB) Viewed 6756 times

If you trace it out you can simple connect jumper wires between the connections on the PCB and a xwhatsit controller.

You would have to de solder most of the chips and passives so they dont interfere

daedalus · 28 Apr 2017, 00:01

As far as I can tell, the 3277s were the first design of beam spring keyboard. As bizarre as it sounds, that PCB is beautiful!

kuato · 28 Apr 2017, 05:03

daedalus wrote: As far as I can tell, the 3277s were the first design of beam spring keyboard. As bizarre as it sounds, that PCB is beautiful!

The tag on the connector says 'JUN 1 1979'. I really rather not hack into the PCB.. hoping we can get enough interest to create a replacement to use with a modern controller.

Redsec · 30 Apr 2017, 06:04

WOW...

__red__ · 30 Apr 2017, 14:52

Honestly, PCB replacement is probably the quickest (and safest) route to ground.

I have a "test" beamspring PCB due back to be in a week or so. If it works as expected I could conceivably put one together for this layout too.

Also, as a point of order... if you don't know how to program in APL, you should pass that keyboard on to someone that does... /raises hand

Menuhin · 30 Apr 2017, 14:56

I find the photos of this older PCB beautiful

The older me a few years ago must find the current me a weirdo...

kuato · 30 Apr 2017, 19:54

__red__ wrote:Honestly, PCB replacement is probably the quickest (and safest) route to ground.

I have a "test" beamspring PCB due back to be in a week or so. If it works as expected I could conceivably put one together for this layout too.

Also, as a point of order... if you don't know how to program in APL, you should pass that keyboard on to someone that does... /raises hand

This would be amazing! Please let me know if I can help in any way.

You know how to program APL?! What's wrong with you?

I'm trying to get the 3277 terminal what came with the keyboard. Waiting on the shipping quote

__red__ · 01 May 2017, 02:55

kuato wrote: You know how to program APL?! What's wrong with you? I'm trying to get the 3277 terminal what came with the keyboard. Waiting on the shipping quote

APL is awesome. You know that it's still in active use by some investment banks because it's the best tool for the job.

Merryl Lynch iirc even has their own version of it which replaces the symbols with keywords (which I think loses the point of the language).

You do know that Kenneth Ivesone, the inventor of the language won a Turing Award for it. Specifically because using mathematical symbolics changed the way that people reasoned about code. It's amazing.

kuato · 01 May 2017, 05:42

__red__ wrote:
kuato wrote: You know how to program APL?! What's wrong with you? I'm trying to get the 3277 terminal what came with the keyboard. Waiting on the shipping quote
APL is awesome. You know that it's still in active use by some investment banks because it's the best tool for the job.

Merryl Lynch iirc even has their own version of it which replaces the symbols with keywords (which I think loses the point of the language).

You do know that Kenneth Ivesone, the inventor of the language won a Turing Award for it. Specifically because using mathematical symbolics changed the way that people reasoned about code. It's amazing.

I was half kidding

You're right, it is used by some of the large investment firms and Dyalog has kept it fresh. Did you learn APL for work or for fun?

__red__ · 01 May 2017, 19:21

kuato wrote: I was half kidding You're right, it is used by some of the large investment firms and Dyalog has kept it fresh. Did you learn APL for work or for fun?

Fun, and I'm rusty. I wouldn't call myself fluent, I'll say that much.

My attraction to it was very much in the spirit of Iveson's original intention. The idea that humans will THINK DIFFERENTLY when they're using a language that is 'symbolic' in nature as opposed to 'keyword' in nature.

Now I'm writing in erlang, elixir, and taking up Haskell at the day-job my need for that kind of functional language has decreased.