IBM 3277 typewriter keyboard / Micro Switch SW Series

[seebart]

a few of you knew I bought this a couple of weeks ago. I'm not so sure if this is worth what I paid for but that's really not measurable right? I'm not sure how I like this keyboard at the moment. It's just soo different from all the keyboards that I own up to this point.Anyway this a MICRO SWITCH Keyboard from 1976 made in Freeport Illinois USA.I cannot see a production date. Maybe one of you knows more. I'd really like to know how old this is. There are a few different production numbers on the case, the PCB, the plate, the bottom plate and the cardboard. I do not know which one is the model number. You can read more about the switch right here which I believe to be the same switch.

http://deskthority.net/photos-f62/1977- ... t5395.html

It seems to be a linear hall effect switch. It feels like it needs lubing but then again how should I know? The keycaps are beautiful. These are the nicest I own. The case is made of solid metal, the bottom plate of even thicker metal. You can see the approximate weight in one picture, it´s built like a tank. The dimensions of the keyboard are (to me) insane. It's small yet very bulky.Remember this is my first really "old" keyboard. If and when I will be using this a wristrest will be a must!From the looks of it the external cable has been forcefully removed. The keyboard sits on thick round rubber feet. What is that piece of cardboard on the PCB for? One of the screws of the case broke when I opened it, I cannot get it out of the case at this point. It will not move. Ideas? The case has some wear but overall the keyboard is in good condition for it's old age. Yours looks nicer Webwit! The one thing that really strikes me are the dimensions. At some point in keyboard production history there must have been a drastic change of how big a keyboard needs to be, probably due to technological advancement in production etc . Of course I knew this before but having something like this sit right in front of me underlines this greatly. I cannot find very much online about this switch and almost nothing about this keyboard. I have read the information we have here at DT on Honeywell Hall Effect and there are a few threads at geekhack. I wish you all a merry Christmas holiday if that's part of your lifestyle. Cheers.

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Honeywell_Hall_Effect

[mr_a500]

It looks like it was made the 27th week of 1976.

[seebart]

ok that little sticker on the plate, wasn't sure if that is a date. Thanks.

[scottc]

Wow! This is quite a find. Perhaps even more interesting than a beam spring, at least more novel.

[seebart]

Thanks. Webwit owns the exact same keyboard. It´s not totally unkown.

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[mr_a500]

I would have thought it was a beam spring keyboard, but it looks like you never can tell for sure. Nearly every computer maker had multiple keyboard suppliers.

Interesting that both UNIVAC and IBM used Micro Switch in the early 70's - even though both had their own switches.

[seebart]

I would have thought it was a beam spring keyboard, but it looks like you never can tell for sure. Nearly every computer maker had multiple keyboard suppliers.

Interesting that both UNIVAC and IBM used Micro Switch in the early 70's - even though both had their own switches.

that's right. You never can tell. I've pretty much given up on the idea of searching for rare items like beam spring or kishaver. It seems almost pointless and random. It´s a nice way to blow money out the window too like in this case.

[mr_a500]

It's not really blowing money out the window. You've got a beautiful... paperweight.

Or you could keep it as an "investment" to resell later (to some insane keyboard freak). Like I always tell my wife, "But... think of the resale value!" That line never works though because we both know that I'd never sell anything.

[webwit]

That's weird. Mine is a beam spring board.

[seebart]

That's weird. Mine is a beam spring board.

that's my luck right there. I get the ancient "Mitsumi" variant. Made my day.

[Muirium]

You got Oaked!

Actually, it's not as bad as all that. Micro Switch made some of the best linears ever, once they're lubed back to shape. Dorkvader is the expert I know around here in those hall effect switches. You could PM him, if he doesn't notice this thread. He knows the difference between early and late Micro Switch boards and might have an idea whether this one has potential for conversion to USB. I see two boards, with that green edge connector and hand wired jumps between. Perhaps the controller is on the other board, away from the switch PCB, which makes life easier.

Are there any IBM markings anywhere on the keyboard? I reckon it could be the "beamspring" equivalent to the infamous Oak switch "Model Fs". Perhaps IBM commissioned third party linear alternatives, in cosmetically similar housings, for some kinds of customer. I believe the Oaks were for true "industrial" environments, as they are better at handling airborne dust than buckling spring.

[mr_a500]

You can see an IBM stamp on the metal. (transformer?)

The switches and sliders look very dusty. That's probably what's making them feel less smooth.

[Muirium]

Yeah, a bit of general cleanup is definitely in call for. The true feel of this board is buried beneath the grime! They're excellent when they're in fine fettle.

[mr_a500]

I believe the Oaks were for true "industrial" environments, as they are better at handling airborne dust than buckling spring.

Good point. Some customers probably also preferred quiet linear keyboards over "monstrously loud" beam springs.

[dorkvader]

Dorkvader is the expert I know around here in those hall effect switches. You could PM him, if he doesn't notice this thread.

<3
I was linked.

So first off the oak FTM on the "industrial" XT was possibly a measure to prevent dust from interfering with the capacitive matrix. You know how a dirty cap PCB can affect switch sensing. OAK FTM may not be as nice to type on but it makes more sense in an industrial setting.

Same with hall effect. There are some that are fully sealed against dust / debris and even the ones that aren't will keep functioning in a really dirty place. I have one from a fisher rosemount controller that was used in a machine shop for many years. IT's awful to type on but still works!

I would have thought it was a beam spring keyboard, but it looks like you never can tell for sure. Nearly every computer maker had multiple keyboard suppliers.

Interesting that both UNIVAC and IBM used Micro Switch in the early 70's - even though both had their own switches.

With hall effect, you can tell by the spacebar usually.
UNIVAC used really old stuff, IBM used them apparantly (that in itself makes this an awesome find) as well as burroughs, and honeywell (of course). In the 1980's convergeant, burroughs, honeywell, TI, wang, and a large number of other people used them. In the 1990's they saw limited use in industrial applications and one SUN numpad.

It's not really blowing money out the window. You've got a beautiful... paperweight.

Currently working to convert all hall effect KBs to USB.


---
So this is a "dual magnet" hall effect KB. You can tell from the round sliders and "box" switch housings. Look for visible wear on the sliders as the housings are harder plastic. Lube everything up with a dry lube like graphite or wet lube like krytox.

HaaTa says corrosionX is great on these, but IDK if he's used it on an older dual magnet KB. It worked magic on a very dirty and awful to type on single magnet burroughs.

I was going to say: probably 1975-76 from the chip. My 1977 board has a different controller chip on it, but my 1976 one has the same ceramic package / gold pins. Pretty sweet!

So the best way to convert these (you get NKRO without diodes, more useful protocol, among other things) is to replace the PCB. Unfortunately these require a PCB, as the sensor is not connected to the switch.

On these single magnet type you can pull the whole switch body off the hall sensor by bending the metal leafs out a little (switches have a channel in them for a screwdriver for just this purpose) and disassemble them easily for cleaning and maintenance.

OK hope this helps. PM me if you need anything else :p At DT I usually only follow the "photos" on the right.

[mr_a500]

Currently working to convert all hall effect KBs to USB.

Awesome. I'd love to be typing on my 1974 UNIVAC keyboard and my blue "TRON-like" 1978 Micro Switch keyboard.

[jacobolus]

That's weird. Mine is a beam spring board.

that's my luck right there.

You’ll notice Webwit’s has sculpted keycaps, whereas yours are uniform. (Which means you can easily switch away from that silly AZERTY layout.)

Judging from the picture of the top of the switches, they definitely need to be cleaned out and lubed. I’m still not sure what the best way is to clean dusty/gritty switch parts. An ultrasonic cleaner would probably give the best results but those are expensive. Just a good scrub with something not too abrasive in some water & detergent might be sufficient.

Some kind of Krytox grease would probably be the best lube, but if that’s too expensive or hard to find then whatever other lube is probably fine. One nice thing about hall effect boards is you don’t need to worry about contaminating switch contacts.

[Halvar]

Seebart, I'm really sorry I misguided you on this, but I was so sure this was a beam spring board from all the materials and the form of the bottom plate. I have seen my fair share of beam spring boards this year, and this just looked like it came from the same plant. Only thing that I found strange and mentioned was the stepped profile.

If you really don't want it I'll offer to take it for the price that you paid. Or maybe someone else is interested, too. This is definitely an interesting keyboard after all.

[Touch_It]

Correct me if I'm wrong but does this have a solenoid in it?

[jacobolus]

If and when I will be using this a wristrest will be a must!

I’d recommend skipping the palmrest. These high slanted keyboards are designed to be typed on with your wrists straight and your arms angled up so that your forearms are parallel to the angle of the keyboard. This isn’t quite as comfortable as a keyboard with a flat angle placed just above your lap, but it’s actually not all that bad, as long as you don’t use it 8 hours/day for years. You want to keep your wrists floating in the air (on any keyboard, not just this type), which should be pretty easy considering how high the board is above the table.

[seebart]

hey guys thank you for your feedback, dorkvader thank you for your insight!

I'm over my initial upset that I did not buy a beamspring. You did not motivate or misguide me to buy anything Halvar! It's all good. Of course I'm keeping this keyboard. It's a rare find alright.

Yes the caps are indeed uniform jacobolus, I just noticed that yesterday. I can switch to any layout I want, that's nice.
I shot some more pictures and learned some more. The chip on the small pcb and that small metal bar do read IBM as you can see.

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Now this is where my jaw dropped: how easy these box switch housings are to disassemble! 2 metal clips and the and the box comes right out! And it´s just a 2 part switch?!? Brilliant. Works just like you say dorkvader.

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That one switch looks quite clean on the inside. Strange. I can see little wear on that slider. I'll have to take out all the the box switch housings and sliders for cleaning anyway.

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I have this stuff for lubing here. It´s a silicon based cream lube. Not sure if I should use that. What part of the switch should be lubed?

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IBM / Micro Switch dual magnet hall effect Keyboard with gold pins from 1976.I like the sound of that.

Currently working to convert all hall effect KBs to USB.

may my dreams come true.

I uploaded a little sound test video, the quality is not that good though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UXzdVv ... e=youtu.be


That's what I like about Deskthority. I still get good feedback from you guys even when acting slightly childish because I bought something and it turned out to be different from what I expected. Respect for that.

[mr_a500]

Another interesting thing (well.. interesting to me, totally irrelevant to anyone else), is that this keyboard is the only IBM keyboard I've ever seen with a "flat-topped three". Even IBM typewriters don't have it. Micro Switch, however, had it on most of their keyboards. That would be the quickest way to identify if a keyboard isn't a beam spring.

For a while, I've been meaning to start a thread about "the mysterious disappearance of the flat-topped three".

[Halvar]

Seems useful. Like in Cherry vs. Alps, the form of the "G" also seems to be distinctive.

[seebart]

Another interesting thing (well.. interesting to me, totally irrelevant to anyone else), is that this keyboard is the only IBM keyboard I've ever seen with a "flat-topped three". Even IBM typewriters don't have it. Micro Switch, however, had it on most of their keyboards. That would be the quickest way to identify if a keyboard isn't a beam spring.

For a while, I've been meaning to start a thread about "the mysterious disappearance of the flat-topped three".

right but this was built by Micro Switch for IBM. Some might argue that it's not really truly 100% an IBM. Personally I would not have thought that IBM commissioned keyboard production externally, but I do not have enough knowledge in that anyhow.

[Muirium]

Ever since I got some German bike grease, I wondered why no company there uses Boba as its brand!

[mr_a500]

right but this was built by Micro Switch for IBM. Some might argue that it's not really truly 100% an IBM.

I know - that's my point. That's the way to tell it's not completely IBM because IBM always had rounded threes.

The "disappearance" I was talking about was a general disappearance of flat-topped threes. Kaypro SMK keyboards originally had it, then switched. TI-99/4A had it on the Stackpole version, but not later ALPS. Keytronic originally had flat-topped threes, but later changed. There's some kind of evil conspiracy going on...

Edit: I also saw that DEC originally had flat-topped threes on their keyboards - VT05, VT52 - but by the time of the VT100, had changed to rounded threes. (all keyboards Stackpole)

[seebart]

Cracking some jokes Mu! I like that. You know apart from the copy right problem that Boba Fett grease might sell really well now that Disney has that new episode coming out next year.

Bounty Hunter grease.Works wonders in fighting rebel scumm!

There's some kind of evil conspiracy going on...

now while a kind of evil conspiracy going on sounds exciting I bet that this also had to do with either some change in production optmization or it might also be that there was a change in some symbol format standard at some point where flat topped 3´s where not allowed anymore. When and why that change took place would be interesting.

Qwerty Layout from 1878 look at the 3.

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Olympia Typewriter 1964:

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these images are from wikipedia btw.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tastaturbelegung

[Nuum]

Very nice! I feel a bit sad for not bidding on this, but it got way too expensive (at least in my current situation) for me at the end. Somewhen I'd like to try a Hall Effect keyboard.

[seebart]

thanks, with this one I can't say if I paid too much or not eventough I did say so yesterday while being beamspring grumpy.

[mr_a500]

these images are from wikipedia btw.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tastaturbelegung

Wow, that page shows a modern keyboard with a flat-topped three:



I thought they had gone extinct.

I found out that they're also called "banker's 3" and were originally designed to prevent easily forging a "3" into an "8" on cheques and financial documents. Interesting.