Keyboard-Integrated Computer

[DerpyDash_xAD]

My father and I have been speaking lately about building a Commodore 64/Sinclair QL style computer. Everyone these days has a laptop - but laptops nearly universally have bad graphics, bad processor, bad screen, bad EVERYTHING.

Our idea (spawned partially by the QL in his trunk) was to produce a screenless laptop, with two things most laptops lack: a handle, and aftermarket keyboards. Another possibility is for home upgrades, easily replaceable parts etc. Finally we are planning on fanless design because nobody likes fans.

So - what do you guys think? Any suggestions? And the part all of this has been leading up to: What layout should the keyboard take? I was thinking G84/KBT Race style, with a small place for trackball/pad on the right side.

Note: I had no idea where to put this, as it is not quite marketplace, not quite off topic, not quite anything, but my main goal is for key layout suggestions, so I put it under keyboard. Sorry if I made a bad call .

[matt3o]

commodore few years ago came out with a mini-itx PC inside the commodore64 enclosure. it was pretty nice actually.

you may want to try cherry ML switches maybe if you want a slim keyboard, I can source you the keycaps if you need.

regarding fanless, it's all down to the PC specs you want I guess.

[Wiper]

Unfortunately, if you want to avoid the problems of "bad graphics" and "bad processor" you'll have to throw your fanless design idea under the bus - in a case the size of a keyboard, even if you had a perfectly-machined set of heatpipes feeding to an all-metal case you won't be able to dissipate enough heat to deal with anything more powerful than a bottom-end mobile processor with integrated graphics. Particularly with the need for it to integrate a keyboard limiting the amount of casing that could feasibly be made of metal and allowed to heat up.

[DerpyDash_xAD]

Then several models would be the way to go - fanless, low power thing, up to noiser than MX blues. Thanks man.

[Findecanor]

I wonder if someone has put a Mini-ITX motherboard into a C64C ... It is deeper than the breadbox, with the motherboard not as much below but more behind the keyboard, and with more cooling vents facing up. Then you could cut the cooling vents to make room for a big-ass metal cooling flange.
BTW. A C64's keyboard is itself ~19 keys wide. Enough for a 60% and a number pad, (maybe a Red Scarf.. )

[matt3o]

[SL89]

I might be picking up one of the last of these, i think it comes with MX Blues built in

[DerpyDash_xAD]

My dad and I were thinking of using laptop parts so it is more compact. We have one dead laptop for modeling, and one we can use for prototyping.

[DerpyDash_xAD]

This needs a codename, any ideas?

[lowpoly]

... - but laptops nearly universally have bad graphics, bad processor, bad screen, bad EVERYTHING.

My dad and I were thinking of using laptop parts so it is more compact.

What?

A keyboard-integrated computer has to be small so you have to compromise somewhere. Have you seen the Novena?

https://www.crowdsupply.com/kosagi/novena-open-laptop

Not exactly what you want but comparable idea (screen-integrated computer).

[DerpyDash_xAD]

The commodore and sinclair were good for their time, and my leopold has enough empty space in it for my eeePC laptop (height/widthh, not depth.). Have a little faith man.

[lowpoly]

Have a little faith man.

I do.

Was just saying that you have to compromise for a small scale form factor. And was pointing out a comparable project, not that you buy it instead.

[matt3o]

iMacs are basically laptops with 27" monitor but laptop components are generally more expensive (starting from the CPU).

You can go with a raspberry pi or a beagle board if you don't need a lot of computational power, in that case you can probably fit everything into a Model M

[DerpyDash_xAD]

This is almost aiming to be a Raspberry Pi done powerfully and with integrated kb/mouse. Also, intel/amd for linux/mac support. I could talk to Gurt about the hardware, I know his daughter.

[Hypersphere]

Nice idea. I have never been able to use a laptop for serious work. One of my favorite computers is the Mac mini. I like the idea of a small form factor and the freedom to use my own monitor(s), mouse, and keyboard. However, I often wish for somewhat more power in the mini, especially with respect to the video component. The new Mac Pro certainly has the power; there needs to be something in between a mini and a Pro.

I like the notion of a computer within a good keyboard. However, for me, this removes a degree of freedom that I have with something like the Mac mini; I would prefer to furnish my own keyboard.

Nevertheless, you have identified a niche that would fill a current technology gap. With the right components and marketing, it could fly.

Good luck!

[DerpyDash_xAD]

I was thinking aftermarket KB's would be available, like the Spectrum. The price of KBs would drop, as controllers could be in the case. Also, aftermarket trackballs and pads. All about choice, man.

[DerpyDash_xAD]

Also, home upgradable, and with addons, like a big-ass battery.

[matt3o]

Nice idea. I have never been able to use a laptop for serious work. One of my favorite computers is the Mac mini. I like the idea of a small form factor and the freedom to use my own monitor(s), mouse, and keyboard. However, I often wish for somewhat more power in the mini, especially with respect to the video component. The new Mac Pro certainly has the power; there needs to be something in between a mini and a Pro.

I like the notion of a computer within a good keyboard. However, for me, this removes a degree of freedom that I have with something like the Mac mini; I would prefer to furnish my own keyboard.

why don't we design the DT-mini?

[Muirium]

An addon board for Model Ms and other classic PS/2 keyboards with spare space inside to fit?

[Findecanor]

My dad and I were thinking of using laptop parts so it is more compact. We have one dead laptop for modeling, and one we can use for prototyping.

BTW, you know about the standalone Thinkpad keyboards, right? Laptop keyboard, trackpad and trackpoint in one, and no need to program a new controller.

[Wiper]

Thinking on your desire for a fanless, capable PC - though it certainly wouldn't be much of a games machine, one of the better-specced Intel NUC boards would make for an excellent general purpose machine (typing, web browsing, video watching etc.). They have extremely low thermal demands - only 15w TDP on the i5-4250U, for example - have an absolutely tiny footprint (far smaller even than Mini ITX), and as an added bonus use by default an external transformer for power, so you don't need to worry about integrating a PSU. I could see one of those integrating nicely with a metal keyboard chassis.

[DerpyDash_xAD]

Also, intel hd 4000 is actually perfectly good for most games at medium settings, so 5000 should also be OK. Even better would be an equivalent AMD A10 board.

[matt3o]

not sure you can passive cool a hd4000

[DerpyDash_xAD]

We were speaking and decided a nice alu heatsink with a fan that only turns on at 70+ degrees.
Keep it cool enough.

[guilleguillaume]

I like where this thread is going. I just love small computers, I wish I was able to move those games with a super tiny silence computer but for now is just a dream.

[DerpyDash_xAD]

The AMD A10 looks good for games. You will have to sacrifice gfx tho

[Wiper]

not sure you can passive cool a hd4000

HD4000 processors are simply the previous generation Intel integrated graphics for their standard processors (e.g. the NUC-friendly i3-3217U was an HD4000 processor), HD5000 the current generation (the i5-4250U I mentioned above integrates HD5000) - as the above attest, both can be present in very low-thermal=output processors; with a well-designed enclosure they should certainly be passively coolable.

[bitemyweewee]

This needs a codename, any ideas?

Beefy Miracle 2.0 Electric Boogaloo

[DerpyDash_xAD]

nice name man, i think i might go for that

[matt3o]

This needs a codename, any ideas?

Beefy Miracle 2.0 Electric Boogaloo

Beefy Miracle 2.0 Electric Boogaloo Redux EX